Get Offset Episode 113: The Pedal Movie

Episode Transcript

Note: a machine made this, so it’s not perfect, but if you’re hearing impaired and have any questions about what we said, please feel free to ask us in the comments or send us an email with the form below. 

Emily: [00:00:00] Trying trying, there it is. Alrighty

Andrew: [00:00:05] so bad

Emily: [00:00:06] at

Andrew: [00:00:06] this. So

Emily: [00:00:15] there you go.

Andrew: [00:00:16] All right. Welcome to the get offset podcast. My name is Andrew

Emily: [00:00:20] and my name is Emily. And we are here today with two friendly faces. Uh, we have Dan and Michael, who are, I guess, at the helm of the pedal movie, the reverb.com pedal movie. Hi guys.

Michael: [00:00:36] Okay. They’re

Emily: [00:00:39] coming to us from very different time zones.

Michael: [00:00:43] Yes,

Dan: [00:00:44] Chicago

Michael: [00:00:46] Scott I’m in, I’m in Scotland, which is further from Chicago.

Emily: [00:00:55] I’m actually wearing one of my favorite Chicago band shirts, frat boys.

Michael: [00:00:58] Oh yeah. They’re they’re friends. We’re uh, we’re big fans. Yeah. I, uh, I’m, I’m friendly with those folks and, um, Evan, one of the reverb staffers, um, the drummer in his band is also the drummer in rap boys, I believe, or they have been at different points.

So there’s a lot of. There’s a lot of commonality there. The reverb offices in Chicago have a lot of like, you know, well, the prior to 2020, I guess, like, you know, seeing musicians, I suppose. So there’s a lot of, you know, you name a Chicago band. There’s probably like six degrees of separation with their band membership back to the customer service department and our marketing department and river.

Emily: [00:01:43] We had Julia on the podcast, um, right after COVID hit because they had started doing their virtual shows. And this is actually a tour, a virtual, it says virtual tour on the bottom. And then it has on the back, all the dates of their live streams this year.

Michael: [00:02:00] So

Emily: [00:02:00] it was funny cause I bought, I bought their original tour shirt ramp.

The tour got canceled. They did their first, ever to her shirt with all the dates on the back. So I have the real one. And the one that was supposed to happen. And then

Michael: [00:02:14] I completely forgot about this, but I think the last live show I saw before COVID was actually their tour kickoff show, which was at the hideout in Chicago.

Emily: [00:02:23] Yeah.

Michael: [00:02:25] I think that was, and

Emily: [00:02:26] yeah, that timing works out. Cause that was like, um,

Michael: [00:02:30] I was like leap day ish. Yeah. And then I cannot remember who was that, or I saw this, uh, Julian lodge show. That was amazing, but it was one of those two.

Emily: [00:02:43] Nice. Uh, I miss it. Uh, I miss live music

Andrew: [00:02:50] pleasure having at least one of you on the podcast. The other one reminds me why I shouldn’t grow a beard ever again

Michael: [00:02:58] because

Andrew: [00:02:59] Dan, that beard is looking excellent.

Michael: [00:03:02] Thanks. I actually shaved it for the first time in like nine years, uh, at the beginning of lockdown, just thinking it would be a good opportunity to try that and then kind of had this like crisis of like self image and confidence and immediately sort of growing it back, which you know, is sort of what happens when you don’t do anything.

Yeah.

Andrew: [00:03:23] That’s about where I ended up. I didn’t intend for this to. Well a little bit, it was more like a curious, like, I wonder if it’s really easy to just let it happen passively because it requires no further

Michael: [00:03:34] action.

Emily: [00:03:36] Yeah. Um, I forget what Rick’s, my husband’s joke is about growing a beard is about people have asked him like, cause he used to have a big beard and people would be asking him if it was like hard to grow the beard.

And he, he just said like, It grows on you,

Michael: [00:03:56] right? He

Emily: [00:03:58] likes puns. There he is. Thank you, reg, filling up my coffee mug.

Andrew: [00:04:05] Nice. This is the part of the show where I say hi, Rick.

Emily: [00:04:08] Andrew says, hi, Rick. He waved. He hates it when I do it.

Andrew: [00:04:13] Well, Emily, what’s new with you this week.

Emily: [00:04:16] Oh boy. Howdy. What’s new with me? Um, I have to think about it.

I have some new pedals, which shouldn’t be shocking, but I was a little bit surprised cause I’m sure I asked for this at some point, but I don’t remember it. Uh, the boss GT 1000 core and I’m just like, damn, this is, I am going to have to dig in and study this space, but I’m very, very excited for it. Thank you.

Thank you to boss for. Sending this to me specifically, Matt Knight. I’m sure. Um, but yeah, I’m really excited. I don’t have like a, um, a helix or a Trek stomp to compare it to, but I’m already just kind of digging around. It’s so interesting that, um, it’s so sad. Cause the only other multi effects I’ve ever played with are really the, um, The pod go.

And it’s so different in format from that though. I think it’s a little bit more, um, versatile. There’s your pod now?

Andrew: [00:05:19] Just kind of holding it in the background, creepily, like doing my best fan and white.

Emily: [00:05:24] Yeah. So flying six months to send me an HX stop. We’ll do some comparison videos, but otherwise this is going to shine on the tone.

I think that was a surprise. I think I will.

Dan: [00:05:39] Which I’m sure there’s a lot of crossover with the effects inside of it, even though the chemistry three is more of like a, kind of a multi effect, but it’s like a multi switcher where you can add effects into the loops, but it’s fantastic.

Emily: [00:05:51] That’s great. I’ve heard stellar things about the Ms. Three.

Andrew: [00:05:57] Remember Ms. Three, it came out when I was working at guitar center. I think I remember getting the first box and I’m like, all right, I got to play with this and pulling out, putting on the counter, just sitting there, like. Where’s the bus. Is he going to see what I’m doing? All right, cool. I’m going to keep going back to it.

It just was really enjoying, having fun with it. I’m like, wait, so it’s, it’s more than just like a Looper with effect. Like it can do a little bit more than this. And I was just, I remember like grabbing you pedals out of the use cabinet. Um, and just like, like, and then the there’s always like the little box of, uh, like the fender six inch jumper cables.

I’m usually grabbing those and setting this all up. Boss finally caught me. He wasn’t happy, but it was fine. I really enjoyed

Emily: [00:06:39] it. Once you to like, be able to intelligently speak about like complicated products, like

Andrew: [00:06:44] pretty sure I supposed to be counting cash for opening. So there’s

Emily: [00:06:47] that. Okay. That makes more sense.

Yeah.

Dan: [00:06:50] Calling reads nonstop, just non-stop call lead calls, right?

Andrew: [00:06:55] Yes. There’s that? Thank you for reminding me of that. It’s the worst day you will walk in and you just get handed like four pages of 10.5. Single-spaced call these numbers by the end of the shift and you have to sell stuff while you’re at it.

Emily: [00:07:10] Wait, so what was the per lead call? I’ve never worked at a guitar center clearly where you just calling customers and trying to get them to buy more stuff.

Dan: [00:07:17] Just you take the yellow pages, you just start opening it and hope that they’re musicians.

Andrew: [00:07:23] No

Emily: [00:07:24] white pages,

Michael: [00:07:26] both.

Emily: [00:07:28] I remember phone books. Oh

Andrew: [00:07:33] my God. No.

My, my store manager made a point of going through the database and like grabbing, uh, like the customers who have bought the most for me. Uh, and putting those at the top of my list away. Hey Jamie, thank you so much for buying that roll in TD, whatever set for three grand. Uh, Hey, I know you’ve already spent three grand with us, but we’ve got a sale this weekend.

We would love another three grand. Am I right?

Emily: [00:07:55] You know what? You’re, you know what that Nord would like a brother or a sister

Andrew: [00:08:00] where the spirit of the Lord is there’s freedom.

Emily: [00:08:03] You have to, you have to have one on your right. And one on your left, like Tori Amos. Yes.

All the dudes like this five guys were like, Oh, of course, that bitch likes Tori Amos.

Andrew: [00:08:20] I just haven’t heard

Dan: [00:08:21] I who doesn’t like Tori Amos. Yeah.

Andrew: [00:08:25] I mean, I feel like her smells like teen spirit covers polarizing, but that’s about it, right?

Emily: [00:08:32] I mean, at least she tried to do something else with it.

Andrew: [00:08:34] Fair.

Emily: [00:08:36] Yeah, no, I love makes me when I feel what I’m want to feel really when I feel sad. And when I feel sad or I just put on little earthquakes

Andrew: [00:08:45] and when I brought a guitar center, that’s not where I expected this go.

Divert, divert. Uh, Emily, what else is new with you?

Emily: [00:08:51] Nah, just let’s skip me. Let’s go. Let’s go to you like Napa about me.

Andrew: [00:08:57] Uh, so the arguably no, uh, arguably, this is true. This is the coolest thing I got this week. No, this is my secret Santa present. I’m going to hold it carefully. Uh, but this is

Emily: [00:09:09] Kelly

Andrew: [00:09:10] from Tom Kelly.

You are the best. Uh, this was not on my list whatsoever. I am pretty sure I put a, a electric kazoo on my wishlist. And then just a generic, whatever. T-shirt you want me to wear on the podcast and left that wide open as possible? It was a little scared leaving that one out there, but, uh, I got this.

Emily: [00:09:31] Yeah, well, I wish I had gotten you.

I would’ve sent you something weird. I would just do the mail guitars shirt.

Andrew: [00:09:39] I was a little concerned putting that in my wishlist, but I was like, you know what? I gotta step out of my bubble. I’m going to do it. Uh, no, the time ended up going with this, it’s an orange camper mug with Fox chiros logo engraved on the side.

Um, so that’s not like it’s not like

Michael: [00:09:53] a sprint

Andrew: [00:09:53] it’s engraved.

Emily: [00:09:55] That’s awesome.

Andrew: [00:09:56] Oh yeah. No, that’s, that’s not something that you can’t rub that off. Um, it’s

Dan: [00:10:01] the next level?

Andrew: [00:10:02] It’s a next level mug. It’s nice and heavy. And it’s orange. That’s arguably the most important part. Speaking of orange, the other thing I got in this week is

Emily: [00:10:12] Oh, from our friends at old blood noise endeavors, that looks like an expression slider.

Dear listener.

Andrew: [00:10:19] With lavender print. Um, so it’s, uh, it’s definitely in the orange family, not quite neon orange, but nonetheless it’s orange and I’m a fan.

Emily: [00:10:29] Did you guys know how much Andrew loves orange?

Michael: [00:10:33] I didn’t

Dan: [00:10:34] really know if you like orange, you’re really going to love.

Michael: [00:10:40] Do we have a closet?

Andrew: [00:10:46] Um, Oh, I, I’m definitely a fan of your, uh, color scheme and I’m just going to duck real quick and you can see the orange guitar.

Uh, that would be my Jennings Voyagers Lux in orange with white binding and white dog hair.

Michael: [00:11:03] We can just make this a episode about this year and sorta totality. Like we can talk about the phase 90, a bit. We can talk about some of the short lived a Toronado finishes from the nineties, just orange, orange gear.

This.

Emily: [00:11:20] Andrew is one that got away was an orange metallic finish, like metallic flake, um, super Sonic

Andrew: [00:11:28] you’re supersonic from the 2012 series. I think it was, it came into the guitar center I worked at and I think it was, I had it on layaway. The sale price is like 400 bucks, something like that. And I just didn’t have the money at the time.

So I had to put it back on the shelf. And now they’re what thousand 1200 bucks.

Emily: [00:11:49] That’s one where you may be asked some friends for some money, don’t ask your friends for money.

Andrew: [00:11:55] Um, the last thing I’ve got here, I’m going to start opening this up. This is, this is the, uh, the prototype from the Mount hood, uh, boost phase that we did with Bruce effects a couple of years ago. And you heard that, right?

That was a couple of years ago.

Emily: [00:12:11] First of all, that, that was like the same, that was Valentine’s day. Um, the year that right around that time, that was when the run out article was coming out and like, I had a grandparent dying and I’m like, I can’t deal with all of this right now. Uh, But at least I had a fuzz pedal.

Andrew: [00:12:29] Well, so we had the PR I had the prototype in hand. Um, and then I was like, well, I’ve got the prototype and now I’ve got my, my copy of the unit. I don’t technically need both, right. This moment.

Emily: [00:12:43] Yeah. So we’ve been sending the prototype around mostly to our Patrion supporters. Um, so they could play with it and then they would send it off to the next person.

And then when wasn’t where they signing like a ledger or something,

Andrew: [00:12:54] there, there should be a notebook in here. We’ll see if it made it and it looks like it did it. Shouldn’t be a notebook where people could leave notes

Emily: [00:13:01] and Elijah haven’t lost

Andrew: [00:13:03] a lion. Yeah.

Emily: [00:13:05] Elia, sorry. Sorry, Elia.

Michael: [00:13:09] So

Andrew: [00:13:09] here we go. And it looks like people signed the box.

Cool. All right. So we got some box signings,

Emily: [00:13:19] somebody draw a Dick on it.

Andrew: [00:13:20] I forgot. Brian did. That’s the serial number?

Emily: [00:13:24] The serial numbers of Dick. Yeah, that sounds like Brian. I was really sad when I opened up my own Badlands and it didn’t have a Dick drawn in it.

Dan: [00:13:32] Normally he does

Emily: [00:13:33] send it back now, money back

Michael: [00:13:36] sounds like a reverb feud in the making.

Emily: [00:13:40] I’m actually afraid to sell his stuff on Reaver because I’m afraid that somebody’s going to open up the back and be like, why are there penises in it?

Andrew: [00:13:47] Yeah. Wow. Everyone wrote a note in here.

Emily: [00:13:51] Oh, we’ll have to go through. We’re not on when we’re not on Michael and Dan’s time.

Andrew: [00:13:56] No, I’m definitely. There’s like several pages of this notebook.

Um, I can’t read this live on the podcast because I will cry. Um, but I’m not going to read it, but I am just gonna there’s notes inside the bag inside the box now. Um, but here we go. There’s the, uh, There’s the prototype and all of its glory, orange included. And I hate to be a hog of time. I just realized I forgot.

Uh, I forgot one more thing that happened to me this week.

Emily: [00:14:29] I mean, I can tell you everything that happened to me this week, if you really want.

Andrew: [00:14:32] No. So I feel like most weeks I’m like, I don’t know what I’d have. That’s new. It’s been pretty slow in this week. It’s been like, boom, boom, boom, boom. Someone ripped me off.

Emily: [00:14:43] Can we talk about that later? After we find out what’s new from Dan? Yeah.

Andrew: [00:14:46] Yes. We’ll talk about that later.

Emily: [00:14:50] As you were going to announce the contest, I figured we would do that.

Andrew: [00:14:53] We’ll do that close to the sponsorship.

Emily: [00:14:55] Yeah. Cool. So let’s start with Dan because he joined the chat first and it’s later where he is. What’s new with you, Dan.

Michael: [00:15:02] What’s new with me. Um, I mean, I’m doing a lot of work on this little movie project.

Um, I am, um, being about as cliche of a person of my age and. And sort of proclivities by getting really into making sourdough bread lately. Um, I have a sourdough loaf cooling downstairs. I learned that you’re not supposed to cut into it for at least three or four hours after it comes out of the oven, which is like the hardest thing not to do because all you want to do is see how it, you know, the crumb formed in rows.

So that’s

Emily: [00:15:42] new.

Andrew: [00:15:46] I like bread.

Emily: [00:15:47] Nice. Yeah,

Andrew: [00:15:48] just didn’t give it away.

Emily: [00:15:54] Oversized sweaters. Nice. How about you, Michael

Dan: [00:15:59] new with me? I think we’ve, we’ve been keeping really busy with the film, like Dan said. Um, but I have been doing a lot of home renovations because of what else? And like gut rehabbing bathroom. That’s fun. Uh, and based sending big goods, we’ve been putting on like my wife and I’ve been putting on Santa hats and driving around and mast of course, and throwing big goods at our friends.

And then. Driving away. So that’s filling the time nicely and we can’t eat all that big goods, got to give them kind of give away. But the thing is when you cook the baked goods and you’re going to get them away,

Emily: [00:16:41] have heard if you read. Yeah, that’s true.

Dan: [00:16:45] That’s true. Um, so

Andrew: [00:16:48] are you like throwing them at people’s heads or?

No,

Dan: [00:16:51] it’s like a gentle, a gentle toss, like, hi, come outside. Okay. Here you go. You know,

Michael: [00:16:59] Yeah.

Dan: [00:16:59] Yeah. A couple of, I love lab. Yeah. We don’t want to break the cookies. Yeah. So that’s, that’s

Emily: [00:17:07] pretty much

Michael: [00:17:10] my baking exercises are significantly more selfish than yours, Michael. My just even needed all

Emily: [00:17:19] this for me. Not for the nice.

Cool. Well, we are going to talk about the pedal movie really, really soon. I know Andrew’s really itching to talk about this shirt thing. It’s like the first week you’re not wearing your shirt. You’re wearing Haley’s shirt.

Andrew: [00:17:39] I think mixing it up. I’ve been trying not to be super vain about wearing my shirt on the show every week, but I am really proud of the design.

It’s the, uh, it is swell of my soul shirt, uh, the graphics of the volume pedal, uh, going from zero to a hundred and. Uh, it’s been selling really well. I’ve at this point, I’m just like sitting in a constant state of like my goodness. Someone just bought three in one order and just like really enjoying, seeing,

Emily: [00:18:07] did he buy them all in the same size or did it seem like, Oh, Ooh,

Andrew: [00:18:15] Um,

Emily: [00:18:17] the whole worship bands getting one,

Andrew: [00:18:20] honestly, I, that wouldn’t surprise me.

Um, I know of a couple of different churches that, uh, all of their guitar players are getting one, um, on Christmas morning. I know it’s super exciting. I’ve been really, it’s really fun to hear all the feedback, uh, in banter from people. And then last, uh, the, in this last week I got a message from Haley at rocket music year.

And she’s like, Hey, have you seen this yet? And I’m like, uh, I’m gonna pull this up my phone. It’s like five o’clock. And I’m like, just staring at this, like, wait, someone ripped off my shirt, design, what the hell? Heck. Uh, so this ran it. I did a little bit more digging. It looks like a random Instagram that was built in the last six weeks.

Um, it must have bought a whole bunch of followers cause it’s got like eight or nine K followers out of the blue. Uh,

Emily: [00:19:09] yeah, that sounds body to me.

Andrew: [00:19:11] I think it’s like beyond pedals or something like that.

Emily: [00:19:16] All right. You’re fine. With the name being out there. Am I gonna have to make a footnote?

Andrew: [00:19:20] Why with the name being other, they, they put it out there and they copied the shirt design and they even, they went as far as the copy of the, uh, the description in the Etsy link on the shop, right verbatim, just full copy.

Um, so I mean, it is what it is. It’s bound to happen. Eventually I’m getting a good laugh out of it because that means I’ve made it right. If someone’s stealing your designs, that means you’ve made it. So I’m getting a good kick out of it. And I’m going to be running a giveaway, uh, to celebrate the, the occasion on Tuesday the day this episode comes out.

So

Emily: [00:19:52] yes, Tuesday, the, uh,

Michael: [00:19:56] I feel like I listened to episode of 99% invisible or something recently that was talking about how large fashion brands can like knock off independent designers really easily, because the there’s like no copyright protection for like, you know, like silhouette and cut and like that kind of thing.

Um, you buy want to listen to them, you know, going up your legal defenses here, I guess, but it’s pretty interesting. It’s not honestly. How’s this for a segue. It’s not honestly that dissimilar similar from copying panel designs where the legal protections are not quite aligned with the reality of the form.

I guess

Dan: [00:20:36] it’s a moral question.

Michael: [00:20:38] Yeah, exactly.

Emily: [00:20:39] I know that urban Outfitters is just famous for ripping off designs. They find on Etsy, like blatantly, not quite as blatantly as Andrews, but like such a big brand. Like just stealing from creators. It’s not, not my favorite thing in the world.

Andrew: [00:21:00] Yeah. It’s definitely, I definitely agree.

And I definitely agree. I had a good discussion with my IP lawyer this week. Uh, and it was just the, kind of the, exactly what you just said. Look, I mean, there’s only so much you can do legally. Um, even though it’s very clear, you made this first, this is your idea. This is your graphic. Um,

Emily: [00:21:17] and it doesn’t help that they’re not located in the United States.

They’re located in a country where copyright protections or intellectual property is pretty much like.

It doesn’t help. It doesn’t help, but that brings us into sponsors who can help you listeners, uh, get offset is sponsor by distro kid. They make it easy and affordable to be as prolific as you want to be musically on the internet, uh, for just 1999 a year, you can upload as much music under your name. And I think one other name as.

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And if you sign up using that link, it supports the show. Financially, you save money. You support us. It’s really low win-win situation. Yeah.

Andrew: [00:23:25] Sounds like a win-win to me.

Emily: [00:23:26] Yeah. Do you wanna hit up, uh, our other sponsor? Price castor concierge.

Andrew: [00:23:32] Yes. Esther concierge. I actually, I had a phone call with him earlier this week.

Uh, it was good stuff. We were talking about some ideas for what to do. I, um, but yeah, no he’s so he’s, I think the most recent thing he’s done that looked really exciting is he sent off a bunch of enclosures to low sounds.

Emily: [00:23:51] Oh, that’s right. Cause we, um, I was on the show last

Andrew: [00:23:55] time. Yeah. We just had her on the podcast last week.

Uh, and so he makes wooden enclosures. So I think he’s got a, it was like a. Um, just a bunch of single size and closures, a bunch of double size enclosures, all wooden, all stained, they all look gorgeous and it looks like he sent them off undrilled. So I low sounds can do whatever they want to with those.

I’m very excited to see that. And, uh, also excited, um, about things that I can’t talk about yet. But anyways,

Emily: [00:24:22] I’m just talking about things like I have a guitar body for it. From, um, him and RD style body that I’ve been meaning to work on for a couple months. Now, I think I finally have an all the parts, so it’s just a matter of cleaning off my work bench in my garage and sanding and staining the damn thing.

And then just putting it together. Like I just need to get off my ass and do it.

Andrew: [00:24:49] I think the, uh, the moral of the story here is I. You got to ask yourself, do you like wood? And if the answer is, yes, go check out parts, gastro concierge and see all of the cool items that they’ve gotten, the shot and all the items that they can make for you out of, you know, it would,

Emily: [00:25:06] yeah, his bread and butter is, um, making bodies for parts, casters, customized bodies for parts, casters, but he can also do the full bill.

So I know that for mine. There were body options, routing options, electronics options. You tell them when you want a, you tell them what kind of neck you want. I think, um, mine is just the drop-in strap neck pocket. So that’s going to be really, really nice and easy, uh, for assembly there. So yeah. Check them out again, link in the video description and show notes.

Andrew: [00:25:42] That’s the, that’s the finger guns, which, uh, I’m pretty convinced are going to have to be like the new greeting once we all start seeing each other in public. Again,

Emily: [00:25:50] I like the snapping point.

Andrew: [00:25:52] Second point is good.

Emily: [00:25:55] You gotta do it in one motion now

Andrew: [00:25:58] let’s cut. Well, I guess the difference between staffing point and a finger guns is whether or not the thumb goes up, which doesn’t make sense.

Cause that

Emily: [00:26:04] doesn’t, you can do the, you can set the thumb up with a full snapping point. I think we, Jesus,

Andrew: [00:26:13] the spin move.

Dan: [00:26:14] I’m a big fan of a spin move because it’s a little, it’s a little flare year. If you’re on the street. If you’re not in close quarters, I wouldn’t recommend it like on a train, but if you’re Oh, it’s just where you do a spin move.

Okay.

Michael: [00:26:27] What do

Dan: [00:26:27] you end with, you can end with the point, just a way to flare up the point a little bit,

Emily: [00:26:34] 360 degrees.

Michael: [00:26:38] Legally, you have to be wearing dark sunglasses though, to do that, or you’re not allowed

Andrew: [00:26:46] to careful.

Michael: [00:26:47] Maybe it’s the Dora too. So

Andrew: [00:26:49] you have to be careful when you do it though, because if you actually click your heels together, you end up in Kansas.

Emily: [00:26:54] This is unrelated, but the fedora comments sent me off. Um, did you see the fender teamed up with someone who makes really nice hats? Like you can actually have a fender fedora and I don’t know how I feel about

Michael: [00:27:06] that. I think it’s the durable

Andrew: [00:27:10] paging paging. Jason morass in aisle four.

Emily: [00:27:18] Uh, I like hats though.

So I was looking at the flat brim black with the bowler kind of top. And I was like gambler. I mean, gambler top. I was like, yeah, that’s kind of, I don’t need another hat.

Andrew: [00:27:28] Well, now I’m imagining you in a bowler hat.

Emily: [00:27:31] All right.

Andrew: [00:27:34] All right. So. Um, pedal

Emily: [00:27:38] movie, worst things people have imagined me in and told me about so

Andrew: [00:27:42] yikes, um, Quip, divert, divert, uh, pedal movie.

There is a question or we, we, we, we postulated something on the podcast, a couple of what, three weeks ago now. And I,

Emily: [00:27:55] I get the last week, I think it was with Aisha. Was it?

Michael: [00:27:58] Yeah.

Yeah. That’s

Emily: [00:28:02] the theme of the year is that time doesn’t exist anymore.

Andrew: [00:28:06] A figment of our imagination, like what even is time. So, um, I had, I feel like I’m dangerously close to becoming Joe Rogan with that comment.

Emily: [00:28:17] You’re not stoned enough.

Andrew: [00:28:19] Have you done DMT? Uh, so. We postulated something and it’s been brought to our attention that possibly, which isn’t uncommon for me, I was entirely wrong.

So let’s settle the record. I have to know ballpark, how many terabytes of data are we working with in your vault right now for this movie?

Dan: [00:28:40] Did you, did you come up with a guess? Did you have like, uh, an answer that you thought was the correct? One, just

Andrew: [00:28:47] curious. I wanted to say something in the ballpark of like a hundred terabytes, but.

I also recognized that I might be backwards, editing myself to try and get closer to the answer.

Michael: [00:28:58] Yeah. That sounds like,

Dan: [00:29:00] I don’t know if most blockbuster films are a hundred terabytes of footage, but, uh,

Emily: [00:29:07] I would say

Michael: [00:29:09] I heard

Dan: [00:29:10] D I think I heard you guys talking about gigabytes and then you were curious about, but there’s about, we have somewhere around like a hundred hours of interview and then.

Many many more hours of Bureau and other supplementary and archival stuff. So I’d say that it’s sitting somewhere in like the six to seven terabytes range

Michael: [00:29:30] of footage.

Dan: [00:29:33] That’s terrible. A hundred terabytes. You could, you could launch a space X craft, a hundred terabytes

Michael: [00:29:41] of data.

Emily: [00:29:45] Oh my God, because that’s red.

Dan: [00:29:52] Very like unimpressive now. Cause he said that it was a hundred.

Emily: [00:29:57] Well, you just start with an impossible number and then you give them a possible

Michael: [00:30:02] number. It’s six or seven terabytes and then another 90. Three or so terabytes of anda of Andy demoing, you know, a chase bliss pedal or something, but we wanted to make sure we got like a really detailed demo of that one pedal.

So

Emily: [00:30:17] yes, the Uttama tone with, uh, the Maris, the M what? I don’t even remember the name of that one. Doesn’t

Michael: [00:30:24] does it C X, M I think it is.

Andrew: [00:30:29] And all of this is just a smoke screen. So you guys get really close footage of how he uses his fingers as a pic to really just nail down what that technique is because how no one

Emily: [00:30:41] knows really

it’s

Andrew: [00:30:43] a mystery.

It’s been a mystery for what a decade now of Andy doing incredible guitar.

Michael: [00:30:50] We have a real great auntie Easter. I actually, I shouldn’t even have said that because I don’t want to reveal this. Okay. I’ve said too much. And I’ve said too much.

Andrew: [00:30:58] Should we edit that out?

Michael: [00:31:00] No, no, no, no. Just bull

Andrew: [00:31:01] will believe that entire part out.

Michael: [00:31:03] No, I just fame like humble, you know, I couldn’t possibly to build intrigue. I’m not going to say more, but you know, that’s, that’s it. Anyway. So jeez bliss, Thomastown. What was it? We love Andy. Yeah, we love Andy.

Andrew: [00:31:20] Andy’s

Emily: [00:31:20] great. So you have a hundred hours of footage and you’re going to put it into a movie as single, single, yeah.

Andrew: [00:31:30] 13 hour movie,

Emily: [00:31:32] uh, 13. Oh, that sounds like a really hard

Michael: [00:31:38] we thought about it. Yeah.

Emily: [00:31:40] Thought about turning the peddle movie into a pedal. Docu-series

Michael: [00:31:45] truthfully. Yeah, we did talk about it early on. And then as COVID came, it was sort of like, well, people have an appetite for long form documentary footage. We were both, I was really into the Michael Jordan documentary series that came out this year.

Um, which is like 20% Michael Jordan highlights. Like they just really Pat out the timeline. I just like having him, you know, donk and stuff. Um, so we, we thought we could do basically the same thing, but, um, just have the footage of like pedal makers being interviewed, interrupted by footage of Michael Jordan dunking in the nineties.

Emily: [00:32:24] You can take the boy out of Chicago, but you can’t take the Chicago boy.

Andrew: [00:32:29] You know, they say, I mean, six seasons in a movie, that’s the ideal show format?

Emily: [00:32:33] Well, I thought it was three seasons in a movie and that was a Disney thing.

Andrew: [00:32:37] Uh, I’m just quoting our bed from community. Right.

Michael: [00:32:40] It’s actually funny. You mentioned that because my wife and I were watching community earlier this year, and then we got to the season, which apparently is like the bad season and just like

Emily: [00:32:48] stopped.

Michael: [00:32:50] I’m not even sure, but there’s like a season where they had different races, last

Emily: [00:32:54] week’s fees. And because it just doesn’t make any sense. And then later in the next season, they, uh, refer to it as like the gas leak. Right? Like the idea is that there was a gas leak and that’s why everyone acted out of character.

Dan: [00:33:07] All the writers quit right here.

Michael: [00:33:09] Right.

Andrew: [00:33:09] So we have the writer strike and at one, well was, yeah, that was definitely a rough season. But anyways, uh, next week on season eight of the pedal show movie,

Emily: [00:33:25] can you imagine,

Andrew: [00:33:25] so how did you guys hours? How, like, how do you kinda condense all of that down?

Michael: [00:33:32] That’s a great question. It’s a big

Dan: [00:33:34] process

Andrew: [00:33:36] out of the sounds insurmountable, insert mountable. That’s how English works. Sorry.

Dan: [00:33:42] It’s pretty insurmountable. Uh, um, you know, as we were going on, we realized, you know, there’s always somebody else that we need to interview.

And also, um, because of the nature of. Things, not only just COVID, but also just the nature of some people, no longer being with us or some people no longer being in the industry or no longer kind of wanting to be involved. Um, we, we use a lot of archival material, so on top of filming our own stuff, we’re also getting in hours of footage from the past,

Michael: [00:34:14] just kind of cool.

Dan: [00:34:18] Right. And so like, as we’re going through all of that word, potentially putting everything into transcripts. And spending months, uh, right. Creating scripts.

Michael: [00:34:30] Well, what we did basically, I mean the more kind of, I guess, sort of like practical process here was we transcripted most of the interviews. We just, based on researching this topic and, you know, talking to everybody and having some knowledge, Michael and I kind of brainstormed.

This is what we think is going to be the broad kind of outline the buckets, the themes, the arrows, the subject matter. And then it’s a matter of going through every transcript, um, and like copying it into different kinds of guidelines, like to make sense of this functional outline that has all these quotations.

And then from there going and digging through all the footage and actually dragging out, you know what, the couple minutes from this hour long interview that’s actually going to be used and where that’s going to go into this. Big thing in that process creates this giant slab of marble, which is like this huge Corpus of different quotations and lines to form a narrative.

And then it’s a matter of just laying that down chunk by chunk and chiseling out this final product, I

Emily: [00:35:31] guess.

Yeah. You, so you took what everyone said, you formed kind of a story around it. And then you use those interviews to tell the story, is that kind of,

Dan: [00:35:45] that’s like, yeah, that’s a, that’s a really, really like simple way of putting it because it’s also like, we’re, we’re trying to tell historical story that’s accurate.

Um, and so, you know, we have to figure out we were not narrating this film and we’re not telling people what to say. Right. We need to make sure that, um, That all the information is there, but also there’s so many kind of like sub-teams within the industry and so much, so many stories that just occur throughout like 70, 80 years of this entire story happening.

So where do we want to dive in here? Where do we want to talk

Michael: [00:36:21] about this?

Dan: [00:36:23] It’s a lot, you can do a documentary on any one of these pedal companies.

Michael: [00:36:29] That’s really, that’s really kind of, one of the main themes of this process is that the. As you kind of zoom in more and more, the detail gets more defined.

It’s sort of this like fractal where like, you know, there, there was enough material to make movie, make a movie about like, you know, analog versus digital technology, right? Like, or, you know, like how I learned to solder. Like you have a lot of things that come up like over and over and over again, but pragmatically, you really only need one person.

Explain explaining how they learn to solder. You don’t need, we don’t need to hear that from every builder. So that’s really been the challenge here is like, um, wanting to include everybody’s voice and everybody’s story in as much detail as possible being, recognizing the fact that it’s not really, um, nanny, not even just not feasible, but also doesn’t make it a necessarily a super captivating film to have the same kind of things set over and over and over again.

So that’s really that, that balance we’re trying to strike is like telling these stories and having the voices that kind of represent the broader. Stories. Well,

Dan: [00:37:29] that’s really important does that this film like resonates with pedal nerds like us, but it also resonates with like music fans, people who might not be super deep into effects, what kind of are aware of them, um, or just like fringe, people that are sitting on the couch, watching with the, with the pedal nerd and, and kind of maybe using this as like a spearhead to get

Emily: [00:37:51] into,

Dan: [00:37:53] get a little deeper and do effects or something like that.

It’s, it’s a top level down. Sort of historical film,

Michael: [00:38:00] right.

Emily: [00:38:03] Working at river, I’m sure you have a general understanding of how many people buy and sell pedals again, not asking for it, not asking for specific numbers, but just like, you know, y’all probably know better than anybody. How many pedals get bought and sold by different people every single year?

Michael: [00:38:20] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it’s a lot, but it’s, it’s one of those things where, um, you’re asking me at a very good time, because I’ve been doing a bunch of research for like a year end blog post. We’re going to do about like used in vintage price trends and stuff like that. So I’ve been kind of deep in the numbers this week, but like, um, it’s one of those things where there’s sort of this like exponential curve where you have like the top 10% of pedal buyers make up like a much larger.

Portion of the amount of like money and like transactions that occur for pedals, because there are people, you know, like you guys may be who maybe buy or sell, you know, 20 pedals, a year, 30 pedals. And there’s people who are more than that, that obviously, um, and that’s like a much bigger portion than maybe like, you know, the couple people who buy like one pedal a year, like, you know, there’s, there’s many of those people, but maybe they don’t account for like the full.

Uh, as, quite as large of a share of the market is like the kind of power pedal flipper community, which is a pretty interesting dynamic, I think.

Emily: [00:39:24] Yeah, totally. So, um, I know that initially the estimate for this film being out was like this past summer, and then of course COVID hit, so. I know that COVID kind of threw a wrench in things.

And you had to do a lot of, um, remote interviews. Uh, how do you think that COVID heading changed the, the potential storyline or the film as a whole, like, did it have a major impact on the story you ended up telling.

Michael: [00:39:59] Uh, great question. I would say coming off, Michael, if you think I’m getting this wrong, I would say probably didn’t really affect the story.

We were trying to tell so much, but definitely changed some things we were able to do in different ways. Um, and that can be a matter of just having to cancel some interviews and shoots we were planning on doing, which is a huge bummer, but pretty. Small and the full range of bummers from 2020. So, you know, can’t complain too much.

Um, so for example, we were, we were, we had our, uh, routed this sort of last filming trip trip to New York and possibly new England for like may that we canceled. And that was going to include. Spending a whole day, Electra, harmonics and filming it. And bill walling interview with Mike Matthews, it never happened.

And we had some other artists sort of lined up that we’re gonna, and, um, you know, even tide and a bunch of other brands, you know, there were kind of, I was kind of the final hurrah that got canceled and, um, you know, we, we, we, I, you know, as I said, it’s, it’s a, it’s a huge bummer. Um, I think the other thing though, to be completely honest, the reason for the delay from the summer has less to do with COVID.

It has more to do with us. Just kind of pivoting the scope of the movie a little bit later in the game. Um, you know, originally when we started making this project, it was really going to be focused on the kind of modern chapter. Um, I can go look back at all my email chains from two years ago when we first started doing this and the working title of the project was like, The rise of the boutique pedal industry, which is a way more Lucas arts title than maybe it was appropriate, but that’s neither here nor there.

So we were really, yeah, so we were really going to focus on like the modern era, you know, the theme. It was going to be a little bit more focused on like the artisans and builders that we know, and like a little bit more in detail on that. As Michael was alluding to earlier, you know, we really want to make this film accessible to people who aren’t just pedal heads, who know a lot about the topic and kind of have their preconceived notions in that kind of thing.

Um, so we decided that it was really important to kind of go back to the beginning and have this kind of first act that kind of tells. The story from like, you know, the thirties, fifties in the origins. Um, so I think kind of wanting to do that part of it justice, in addition to some of the, just like the functional delays that happened with COVID, um, kind of combined to create that delay.

Dan: [00:42:32] There is another, um, I’m an optimist. So there, there is another kind of silver lining that came out of, of, uh COVID, uh, despite all of the negatives, um, which really was that because we. We were almost forced into having this extra time, um, by necessity to kind of like step back and go, okay, like how do we get Mike Matthews in this film?

Even though we cannot physically go film him once we started realizing, okay, we can part, we can utilize some of our friends and partners and filmmaker, friends who have, who have done things in the past with some of these folks, we also started to realize, well, this is a way that we can start to lean on our.

More tech savvy and, uh, uh, pedal friends or media friends, even like yourself, mentally, who we can interview for abroad because they have filmmaker friends, and we can kind of include more voices that we were hoping to include in the first place. Uh, we were just hoping to do it in person. Now we’re able to actually bring in.

So we were able to actually conduct and actively realize, Oh, we can do more interviews. Maybe, uh, if we just do it this way. And that was kind of a blessing because we were able to, uh, uh, get a lot more voices and, uh, when all of a sudden done

Michael: [00:43:53] just good.

Emily: [00:43:55] Yeah. How many, how many remote interviews do you think you did?

Michael: [00:43:58] Uh, I want to say probably like no more than 10, maybe six.

Dan: [00:44:04] Well,

Emily: [00:44:04] Oh

Michael: [00:44:06] no. I’m trying to think

Dan: [00:44:08] here. Thinking of ones that you did.

Michael: [00:44:11] Yeah, my entire world, just based on my own experiences,

Emily: [00:44:17] this is very

Dan: [00:44:17] true. It’s probably somewhere around 15. If you count a couple of artists and a couple other things, I did interviews that I did or things that were commissioned

Michael: [00:44:27] the other is just doing stuff.

Yeah. The other thing I want to call out, which Michael alluded to, but I think it’s a cool thing to mention is that. We have two, uh, partners who we’re working with, who have been really amazing and are giving us access to a big repository of interview footage that we’re using to supplement particularly the historical part of the film.

Um, and I don’t want, I want to give them some props because they’re so been so great to work with. One is, uh, the Nam oral history program, which if you’re not familiar with that, it’s like this it’s this really cool thing. The name organization does where they interview industry people every year at the Nam show and they have this library it’s on their website.

Um, just of like, it’s not just guitar stuff. They have, you know, synthesizers, trumpets, whatever, but they have people talking about their like life work, you know, designing instruments or being involved with the music gear business and somewhere and other. So through that, we were able to get some old archival interviews, some folks who were no longer with us who represent important parts in the story, and that’s been really wonderful.

And the other one is, um, our dear friends over a Dunlop slash an XR. I’ve done a couple of similar historical projects to this for like some of their own brands and product lines about like the MXR brand and, um, the crybaby. So, um, that’s, that’s helped kind of fill in those chapters a little bit as well, and they they’re legends.

Emily: [00:45:52] Awesome.

Andrew: [00:45:55] So question I have for you. So you filmed all of this and then you’re coming back and looking at and figuring out how to just condense this all in a way that makes sense. That tells a story. And at some point along the process, I’m sure it had to have occurred to you. Um, the, the moment of fear of are we incidentally being revisionist in the way that we tell this story here.

And how do you, how do you wrap your brains around that and get ahead of that in a way that ensures that you guys are being honest to the stories that other people have told, or is that not even a concern?

Michael: [00:46:29] That is a, that is a very good question. That’s a Terry Gross level question. Good job. That’s okay.

It’s it’s really hard. And I don’t think anybody here would be surprised to learn that there are people who care about music, your music, your history, and pedals and things who have very fierce opinions about how much more an expert they are than the other person or that. And, you know, history like, especially when you’re talking about recollect, I mean, I’m no professional historian, but I’m, you know, studied history in college.

And like, this is like the fabric of how history is done is like somebody remembering something that happened 20 years ago, it’s not going to be actually what happened. The source that you’re working with is their recollection and memory of it. So there’s always going to be some gray areas that exist.

There’s always, and frankly, I won’t go into specifics here because no spoilers or anything, but there’s at least a few. Things that we’re aware, there are kind of like contradictions. And he said, she said sort of stuff that comes up. I think the best thing you can do to square that is try to be somewhat objective and showing different perspectives, showing different sides of the story, um, and being req and in sort of lean to the fact that like the fact that the truth is in big EWAS is the truth in and of itself.

That’s crazy. Late night dorm room talk, but you know what I mean? It’s like, it’s like, um, I think as long as you is, you’re not trying to like mislead anything and being like very upfront that like, this is, you know, there’s some conjecture here and some assumption and some fuzziness, like particularly fuzziness, um, that, that that’s, that’s a valid way to approach it.

Dan: [00:48:11] And the other good thing is, you know, for the most part we’re basing, even if there’s multiple. Faces talking about the same subject, as much as we possibly could. We’re corroborating whatever information we can through the, through the, the, the main person’s story, even if it’s not them speaking the entire time.

So if we’re talking about electro harmonics, You know, the majority of the information that we’re trying to corroborate against is from Mike Matthews. Right? So if he’s telling the story, we’re assuming he’s telling it correctly. Um, same with Robert Keeley or same with, you know, any number of people. Um, and then if, if somebody’s popping into sort of say, you know, this thing or this thing we’re kind of going, is this correct?

And fact checking it against maybe something that actually came up in the Mike Matthews interview. So there’s a good amount of fact checking and things like that nature. And then, like Dan said, like, there are a couple of those really fun ambiguities. Um, they’re still coming from the mouths of the people who made them ambiguous in the first place, but that’s part of the fun it’s kind of up to you to decide, right?

Emily: [00:49:28] Yeah. That’s a good point.

Andrew: [00:49:30] Yeah. I mean, I. I don’t mean for that question to come off as like leveling accusations. Cause I really don’t, I’m not concerned about that from either of you, but I think get some important for listeners to hear. Um, and I think especially in a subject where people are so passionate about this, um, and people who have dug in themselves into a lot of the history, um, before watching this movie, I’m sure that that’s, there’s, uh, a risk of people being upset.

With the reality being different than what they understood it to be.

Michael: [00:50:02] Yeah. You know, I think that’s, that’s an interesting point. It’s not something that we’re super worried about because when you see the movie you’ll understand like a lot it’s, it’s, there’s, there’s very few instances where somebody says something like this thing was the first one of these things and it is the most important, like there’s not, it’s, it’s much more kind of.

Broad stroke. And like in like, um, general as in generalizations and, um, sort of influences, it’s not like, I mean, frankly, if somebody wants a definitive timeline of every pedal and every pedal company and like the exact order, you know, like, I’m sorry, that’s this is not necessarily the movie for you. Like it’s,

Emily: [00:50:45] some people have really seem like they want that.

Yeah.

Dan: [00:50:47] Right. And, and for that, there are books, but you could, that w that that would be a 10 hour film. Right,

Andrew: [00:50:53] right, right.

Emily: [00:50:55] At least,

Andrew: [00:50:56] at least. Yeah. I’ve got the pedal crush book sitting over there on my bookshelf and read through that a couple of times I’ve got a history fender book over there.

Michael: [00:51:05] Um,

Emily: [00:51:06] if you

Michael: [00:51:07] flip to the very end of the pedal crush book, you’ll find the historical timeline of pedals that I wrote for it.

And most of the information in that is like, it overlaps quite closely with the research we did for the movie. It’s like basically pedal crushes, like a secret. Yeah. Sorry.

Dan: [00:51:28] I think people, what people should be hoping to sort of get out of this film is. The broadest stroke story that we’re trying to tell here is more so how does ingenuity of human beings combined with technology influence music and how does that continue to happen over and over again, and vary with completely different backgrounds and stories?

Really that’s, it’s the story of all of these things interweaving throughout decades and decades and decades,

Michael: [00:52:01] right? Exactly. It’s, it’s not like, you know, if somebody wants to, if somebody, I, I sound like I’m being like, defensive about this, which really don’t mean to me. But like, if your intention is to watch this movie and have find like a gotcha, like, Oh, they didn’t talk about this, or they didn’t bring up this, or they didn’t interview that.

Like, you’re going to have a really easy time because it’s not feasible to make a movie that goes into detail at every, you know, there’s lots of people that we didn’t include. We, you know, we. Well, couldn’t get to, or literally thousands of federal companies. That’s kind of, one of the points of the movie is that there’s too many to keep track of.

Like, but even historically, and it’s like, again, it’s like, um, you know, we, we have, we, I think what we’re trying to do is have like, sort of, um, what’s the word I’m looking for? Um, Kind of case studies for different eras in different themes and different topics and different pedals and like different sort of, uh, trends and things like that.

That’s like, Oh, this is like how this happened in this company or this person or this musician did it. It’s not necessarily a Rolodex, but it’s like, um, you know, it’s more, I mean, in a Ken’s in a Ken burns film, for example, like, um, I’m going to kind of. Show myself to be a bit of a civil war nerd here for a minute.

But, um, in the civil war, convergence of a war series, it’s really great. And he does a good job offering sort of overview, you know, survey of the history of the war, but it doesn’t talk about every single battle. You know, it doesn’t talk about every single general, but what it does do is it shows you humans who experienced the words through their letters and through their journaling.

And it’s like this one, this one, you know, um, person in the South. Right. And about her experience, living in Richmond is sort of like the case study for lots of people living in the South. We don’t necessarily to hear from every single one of them.

Right. Good

Emily: [00:53:57] example. But like, I have seen that a couple times and message boards. Like how could you have a documentary about guitar pedals without including this person or this person or this person I’m like, well, that person had, they all had a lot of peers and they all had a lot of people making pedals and.

They were all influential in their own ways. And you just, you can’t talk to, or about all of them, it’s just not feasible.

Andrew: [00:54:25] I mean, I think that’s just the nature of the beast of the documentary, which, uh, don’t mind me. I’m just logging into, uh, the gear page so I can rant about this.

Emily: [00:54:33] Oh, is it, are you pulling up?

Oh,

Andrew: [00:54:35] are you going to actually.

Emily: [00:54:38] I

Andrew: [00:54:38] don’t, I don’t have a login for the gear page. I have a modicum of self-respect. Uh, so I think it’s just the nature of the beast with all of this

Michael: [00:54:50] a hundred percent. And like I said, there’s going to be people who were on a watch this, and they’re going to, you know, share their opinion about how, where.

Criminal for leaving out so-and-so and not talking to so-and-so and you don’t like, you totally get it. But I think, I think that perspective is one where it’s like, it’s, it’s just, it’s just physically, you know, it’s not possible to reach every single person in this industry. It’s really expansive and really, um, you know, multiple ways.

That’s okay. Yeah.

Emily: [00:55:22] I’m sure I got to assume that you all wanted to hit different, like just. You could have done, Oh God, I don’t even know how to say this. You could have, I don’t know I was going to cut that out because we don’t, but I feel like just looking at the preview that looks pretty diverse in terms of different types, different sizes, different pedal company that speak to different genres, different time periods.

Like it’s not, like you said, just focused on, you know, the post two thousands, not just focused on, um, The, the, the original effects that Jimmy Hendrix used. It’s not just focused on this Americans or Brits or anything. It’s a lot of things.

Andrew: [00:56:09] Yeah. Sorry. A question that I have is my partner. My wife is I. Has been watching me just dive deeper and deeper into this rabbit hole over the last few years and, um, scratching her head on occasion.

And, uh, but recently we’ve gotten into talking about like, okay, well, could you show me like some of what all of this does? And, um, I think I sent her the video of the reverb.com video, uh, uh, the show kids, teaching kids, what the, the effects are. That video is phenomenal. Uh,

Michael: [00:56:41] and so

Andrew: [00:56:43] watching that with, uh, with Melissa was.

It was really neat. And I, I guess my question looking forward to the pedal movie is, is this something that you feel like, can I go to her and say, Hey, so this is gonna come out and we’re gonna sit and watch it together for the first time. And it’s not going to be weird. It’s not going to be like me strapping.

You do a chair and make you watch star Wars with me.

Dan: [00:57:03] First of all, I so incredible that you. That you showed somebody who’s not into effects that video. Cause that was like the entire reason why we made it was to make like a fun video that was a primer for like anybody, children or adults, anybody. So that’s really cool to hear.

Um, but yeah, I think, I think it is. I think, I think the reason that we’ve sort of pivoted to film, to like, let’s make this like. Um, let’s make this a human story. Let’s make this a story about history, about ingenuity, about like actual people that are kind of remarkable and kind of created this entire industry.

Um, and then furthered it throughout all of this stuff is a story that, that is meant to appeal to a wide range of people while kind of also. Um, helping them realize like, Oh wow. These things that actually had a lot to do with how music sounds and if you like music, and if, you know, if you’d like the sort of penalty bands, whether you are into pink Floyd or Radiohead or whatever, um, you’ll probably find something in the film that you’ll really enjoy, even if you’re not a pedal, uh, you know, pedal nerd.

Emily: [00:58:11] Yeah. I think the best documentaries. Are the ones that really get into the human aspect of whatever the subject matter is to the point where like, if you don’t like basketball, maybe you can still enjoy the last dance. If you don’t like baseball, maybe you can still enjoy Ken burns baseball series because it talks about human elements.

Like I think those are the best documentaries where you can. See it’s on start watching it and be like, I don’t know what this is at all. And then come out with some sort of understanding or at least connection with, um, if nothing else, the people in it.

Dan: [00:58:48] Yeah, a hundred percent. It’s like one of the biggest reasons why we wanted to make this film was because over the last for me, six years for Dan, eight years of sort of being, um, involved with a lot of these brands, you get to know them, but you realize that for decades, for some of these companies, decades, people just associate them.

They don’t associate a person. They associate a brand, they associate a name way huge, or they associate GHS or whatever. They don’t really know the person buying it. They don’t sometimes realize that it is just a handful of people or it’s one person it’s not assembly line companies. And even for the larger companies, they don’t really associate the history behind, like what Mike Matthews actually accomplished.

They think about a massive factory. Right. So I think it’s important when you actually realize like how. Influential and important affects pedals were to the creation of sounds and music. It’s important to look at who was behind that stuff throughout history. And that continues today.

Emily: [00:59:49] Yeah, that’s really cool. Well,

Andrew: [00:59:54] go ahead, Andrew. I guess the, the followup thought that I have in the back of my head is just this unrealistic hope that people will be able to sit down and watch this with their partners and be like, all right. So I’m going to start talking about per my purchases with you because now I feel like we both understand why this is so important to me instead of lying about purchases and sneaking into the closet and.

Uh, posting all the dumb memes to the internet about, I learned my wife. She’d done.

Dan: [01:00:25] I definitely can’t speak for anybody’s significant others or partners, but you know, it, it could, it could not, it could, I don’t, I

Michael: [01:00:36] don’t know.

Andrew: [01:00:39] I mean, in general, it’s not like that should have to have in Fremantle ideas, but yeah,

Michael: [01:00:43] sure.

Certainly help elucidate how. Um, there can be so much variation, you know, and how it’s, it’s not like the sort of thing where you, why do you need a pedal? You already have a pedal. I mean, I mean, I don’t think most people are saying that, but I think that dynamic of like, I

Emily: [01:01:00] feel that way sometimes when I look at my pedals, I’m like,

Michael: [01:01:06] that’s, that’s a, you know, it’ll, it’ll help with that at least.

Andrew: [01:01:09] Yeah. I think the family element of. Making it accessible. Um, I think that’s really neat and I’m really excited for all the ways that that’s going to flush itself out.

Michael: [01:01:19] And, and like, I think, you know, I think a lot about my, uh, my dad, when we talk about this sort of thing, I think this came up, went by when I were talking recently, I was like, my dad has been playing guitar since the sixties and he’s like a really good musician.

Um, But he doesn’t like, like he’s been on the reverb email list, you know, since the company started is because he wants to support me and stuff. And he’ll he’s has said to me in the past is like, Hey, you guys send me all these emails, all these different pedals. I just don’t get it. Like, why do you need that many pedals?

Why don’t you just get a multi offense? And it’s like, You know, that’s a good point, first of all, but that’s neither here nor there, but it’s like, you know, but I mean, he loves classic rock and he, you know, he’s interested in like music history and stuff, just like, you know, like, Oh our dads, I guess. But like, um, so he, he’s maybe a little bit more invested than like, you know, random person who’s not involved with music or playing music at all.

But this film, I think it’s like, if anything gets you to answer the question. Why would you, why wouldn’t you just get a multi effect? It’s like, there’s this connection that Michael was alluding to between the history of the pedals, the history of music in general. And I think if we can inspire people to understand that that it’s and was so cool that it’s a cyclical relationship, right?

It’s like if somebody invents a piece of music technology, this is, I mean, this is a much broader theme that goes way beyond pedals, but I I’m always obsessed with this. It’s like, Somebody creates a piece of music technology. Some musician uses it, maybe they use it in a way that wasn’t intended. And the next generation, that music technology incorporates the way that person was using.

And it creates this feedback loop between engineer developer, designer, and musician. That is how you get things like, you know, pad based samplers were out of drum machines. Like it’s, it’s like, that’s a very weird evolutionary path for the technology to follow, but it’s the way that people misused the technology.

Dan: [01:03:15] And to go back to the previous point that you guys were talking about about. You know, I’m sure people are going to be upset about X or Y person not being involved. You know, you have to remember that when we’re going through and, and when this is such a large story, that isn’t just about individual stories, right?

We’re trying to tell story the entire story, which has a lot more to do with general trends and themes and things that occurred, you know, Part of the reason why the people who are in the film art in the film. And of course there’s many, many more that we wish we could have, uh, interviewed is because we needed folks that could speak to a certain, very specific, larger, broader thing than just their company.

Right. And we needed multiple folks who are knowledgeable in a certain aspect or in multiple aspects of not only the historical aspect of effects pedals, but also like. The larger part about certain technologies, DSP technologies or any number of things which you’ll see in the film. And so that is why this sort of diverse sort of, uh, amount of folks in the film, um, is the way that it is.

And it isn’t necessarily every single person that you could possibly think of.

Michael: [01:04:34] Right. A really good example of this would be, um, one of my favorite interviews we did was with, uh, Mike beagle, who is one of the co-founders of neutron music tronics back in like the early seventies. In fact, you can actually watch a big chunk of that interview on the river YouTube channel, if you are so inclined and that’s about.

Um, as close to, uh, you know, extended look at the movie I think is out there. Um, so, you know, Mike bagel, we did this great interview and he spoke to these themes of like, what was it like starting a music company in the early seventies? How did his background as an electrical engineer and a synthesizer enthusiasts at MIT is an undergrad inform his approach, designing pedals and co it’s it’s it’s like this and how, you know, how is him hearing.

You know, uh, Stevie wonder using a neutron, like how did that change his life and his perspective, you know? Um, so he, he, you know, he’s a really great person who speaks to a lot of these kinds of general themes, but, you know, we don’t have interviews with people who found everybody who founded a federal company in the early seventies.

We don’t have interviews with, um, you know, the people from like Fox or DOD, for example. And it’s not from lack of wanting to have those people represented. Of course, it’s just that, you know, we can only. Do so much. And you know, we have to cover these things again, more on like a thematic level than a Rolodex, you know, here’s company one here’s company, two years company three.

Dan: [01:05:57] And that doesn’t, that isn’t to say that those companies aren’t represented in some way or mentioned in some way, it’s just that maybe somebody from that company was not interviewed.

Michael: [01:06:06] Right?

Emily: [01:06:08] Yeah.

Well,

Andrew: [01:06:12] Carol, I want to watch it.

Emily: [01:06:15] When can people watch it? Do you think?

Michael: [01:06:17] So that is the million dollar question. Um, w in the spirit of total transparency and honesty. Um, we haven’t actually made a movie at all. This is all a big scam because reverbs evil whenever now, um, in a transparency, we don’t have a hardly state yet because we’re still waiting for a few.

Boring kind of administrative pieces of the puzzle to fall into place, um, you know, various kind of clearances and, and, and that kind of thing. Um, yeah, that’s really what it comes down to. And I don’t think we’re making, we’re going to shock anybody to say that this is the first time we’ve made a feature film, um, for commercial release, we maybe, eh, maybe somewhat underestimated the, um, Rights legal component of this and what that would require of us a little bit to put it generously.

Um, our, our hope is that it’s going to be okay. It’s going, we’re going to have a hard date relatively soon, hopefully in the next few weeks. And that hard date will be by the end of January. It is possible. It will be a little bit later than that, but that’s what we’re working with right now. But I will say

Dan: [01:07:32] as soon as

Michael: [01:07:32] possible, Yes.

If anybody wants the latest information, uh, follow ask the pedal movie on Instagram. And Twitter, we did make a Facebook page, but I’m never going to update it so you can skip that one.

Emily: [01:07:46] So, uh, that sounds like a good place to wrap it up. Thank you so much to Dan and Michael from the pedal movie, follow the pedal movie on Twitter and Instagram.

I’ll include links to that in the video description and the show notes. Um, check out, Andrew’s contest that he’s running on the Fox Cairo. I’m sure. Get off that. We’ll share that on Instagram and Twitter. Uh, and probably Facebook, but I think the content is probably going to be on Instagram from what Andrew has told me.

Um, anything else we need to say? Andrew’s on mute.

Dan: [01:08:27] Thank you for having

Andrew: [01:08:28] us. And I wanted to thank you guys, both. Sorry. I was on mute, uh, for, for being on the show, but more importantly, I thank you so much for putting in all of the, the blood, sweat, and tears into making this movie. But I know that’s not that that’s a huge undertaking for both of you and for you guys to go out of your way to make this happen, I think is gonna have a huge impact.

And we’re really appreciate. Yeah.

Dan: [01:08:53] So we really hope so.

Emily: [01:08:55] Thanks. Great. Well, um, to everyone out there listening.

Yeah.

Andrew: [01:09:05] Alrighty. Well, my name, sorry.

Emily: [01:09:08] Sorry, Dan. We’ll uh,

Andrew: [01:09:11] figure it out.

Emily: [01:09:16] Um, I think you’re a little delayed. Yeah, well, um, to everyone out there. Thanks for watching. Listening. Thanks for understanding. Um, once again, my name is Emily.

Andrew: [01:09:24] My name is

Emily: [01:09:25] Andrew. Last of Dan and Michael from the pedal movie. Um, goodbye. .